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blakes7-d Digest				Volume 99 : Issue 236

Today's Topics:
	 Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
	 Re: [B7L] Holidays/presents
	 Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
	 : [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
	 Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
	 Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
	 [B7L] Where is Freedom city?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 11:25:47 PDT
From: "Hellen Paskaleva" <hellen_pas@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
Message-ID: <19990731182549.90498.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

Kathryn, RE my thoughts concerning the plague in "Killer:

> > ...Viruses usually affect the
> > one's body, linking to the one's DNA. Therefore, it is needed deep space
> > trips to cause some kind of mutations in the human's DNA (which 
>mutation, as
> > a feature, to be "recognised" and affected by the virus).
>
>This is what Dr. Bellfriar said about the virus:
>"Everyone who's been into deep space has had the Terran (PL)ague..."

><snip, because all of us are well awared of the script>

I *do* know Dr. Bellfriar's opinion. What *I* am saying is, that the 
explanation is SCIENTIFICALY incorrect. We have to pay attention to author's 
viewpoint, but we *MUST* differ the improbable from the impossible. Dr. 
Bellfriar's explanation could be considered ONLY as a AUTHOR's lack of 
knowledge in the field of virology, not as a scientifically supported 
statement of the (truly existing in the future) biologist.

If it would have been just a kind of fairy tale, then, OK, we could imagine 
all kind of impossible things and put them in it. But, seems to me, if in 
the B7 we find something CLEARLY impossible to exist in the real world 
(like, for example, the laboratory in "Animals"), we HAVE to negate it, 
instead of accepting it word-dor-word literally. (Thoughts, no one would 
seriously insist, that there were ONLY two Federal guards on the planet 
surface in "Shadow", just because only two of them have been seen... and 
written in the final titles...)

Just thoughts. Hellen



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Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 19:47:37 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Holidays/presents
Message-ID: <19990801024741.38693.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

Back to pressies for our Loved Ones...

Blake - well, obviously a Sucessful Rebellion. Or Avon with
laryngitis for a fortnight. But on the grounds that they're a little hard
to wrap, I agree that books (military history, politics at the top of the
list) would be good.

Jenna - her very *own* Blake clone (yes, also hard to wrap, but I
think she'd overlook that).

Vila - his very own ex-Federation rest centre, or just the the sensory
ecstasy hour machines.

Avon - an Orac with a different personality (on the other hand he
wasn't that keen on Zen at first). Blake with laryngitis for a fortnight.

Cally and Gan - new wardrobes, chosen by someone else.

Tarrant - what would be the 23rd century equivalent of sky-diving? A
subscription to that.

Soolin - hard to think of anything she'd like - I thought of antique
guns, but I don't see her as interested in them as anything but tools
of the trade. New additions to her hair-styling kit?

Dayna - what she would *want* is easy. Servalan's head on a pike.
The girl needs nother another hobby...maybe some decent sheet
music? Or a new instrument to learn (bagpipes? Just for the sake of
driving the others crazy...)

Travis - what *he* would want is even easier. Blake's head on a pike
(and possibly Avon's, after Aristo...) Perhaps a leather-polishing kit -
I’m sure Avon could suggest a brand, probably one that makes the
leather catch fire while you’re wearing it.

Servalan - well, she'd want the Liberator, in one piece this time. Or
maybe just Avon...but we can't all have what we want, can we? Let
her get hankies...


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Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 01:31:11 -0600
From: "Ellynne G." <rilliara@juno.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
Message-ID: <19990728.013527.9926.0.Rilliara@juno.com>

On Sat, 31 Jul 1999 11:25:47 PDT "Hellen Paskaleva"
<hellen_pas@hotmail.com> writes:
>Kathryn, RE my thoughts concerning the plague in "Killer:
>
>> > ...Viruses usually affect the
>> > one's body, linking to the one's DNA. Therefore, it is needed deep 
>space
>> > trips to cause some kind of mutations in the human's DNA (which 
>>mutation, as
>> > a feature, to be "recognised" and affected by the virus).
>>
>>This is what Dr. Bellfriar said about the virus:
>>"Everyone who's been into deep space has had the Terran (PL)ague..."
>
>><snip, because all of us are well awared of the script>
>
>I *do* know Dr. Bellfriar's opinion. What *I* am saying is, that the 
>explanation is SCIENTIFICALY incorrect. We have to pay attention to 
>author's 
>viewpoint, but we *MUST* differ the improbable from the impossible. 
>Dr. 
>Bellfriar's explanation could be considered ONLY as a AUTHOR's lack of 
>
>knowledge in the field of virology, not as a scientifically supported 
>statement of the (truly existing in the future) biologist.

First, let me say right off that it takes a king sized idiot to use
biological warfare which, by its very nature, tends to be uncontrolable. 
The aliens, however, have can be assumed to have a different enough
metabolism the disease they made doesn't effect them.  Avon, on the other
hand, would have to be nearly as bad as Travis with his final act to use
it, especially if he hadn't done extensive field tests on the antidote. 
Even the aliens seem to have taken about a thousand years to feel ready
to use it.

But I'm going to try and be creative and find ways the disease itself
could have worked as described.

Bellfriar's use of the term virus could have been an error (maybe he was
exiled to the middle of nowhere precisely because of the way he confused
simple terms.  Then again, maybe he wasn't just being nice when he told
Blake he was an absent-minded scientist who had already forgotten who
Blake was). Environmental factors, such as acidity and nutrients present,
can effect both disease growth and its effects.  A harmless bacteria
becomes deadly if the toxins it creates can't be cleaned out, etc.

The question is what is the ague and how does it effect the body?  The
ague itself seems unlikely, but since I never did grasp B7's explanation
behind faster than light flight, I can't make up an excuse here.  Let's
say there is an ague.  Let's say it causes structural differences in the
body.  Could these cause toxins to accumulate in ways they normally
wouldn't?  Do they create ways for the disease to grow at a higher rate
or to grow in areas they couldn't in an unaltered lifeform?  It could get
gross.  Take a helpful bacterium from the stomach and transfer it to the
brain and Very Ugly things can happen.  

I have enough of a grasp of biology to know reasons why this is unlikely
in the extreme and why the only examples I can draw from real life are a
bit of a stretch, but when did that stop us?

Ellynne

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 23:41:20 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: : [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
Message-ID: <19990801064124.93228.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

Mistral wrote:
<I did think, however, that the original question wasn't about
releasing it at Fosforon, but using it later, as a weapon...>

Fair enough. Sorry, I was replying more just to Dangermouse's post
and not to the thread in total, some of which I seem to have missed
getting and/or reading... :-(

When I said "I believe Avon would have done it" I also meant let
Servalan's crew take the plague, regardless of the risk of some getting
free. I do agree that Avon would not have cold-bloodedly released the
plague as a weapon against the Federation. He may not care much if
bystanders get hurt in his battle against the Federation, but he doesn't
deliberately target them (He's ruthless. He's *not* evil.)

Even if either of them were heartless, fanatical or desperate enough to
consider it, Blake at least has enough historical knowledge (and both
have enough intelligence) to know that 'germ warfare' is a very
unpredictable and uncontrollable weapon as dangerous to the wielder
as the victims. With the destruction of Control/Star One (which,
after all, he studied long and hard before deciding to go for it), Blake
knew (or believed he knew) what would result...with a plague, he
would realise that he couldn't even predict it.

The isolation of the different planets would certainly allow *some*
to revolt and get their freedom - but wouldn’t equally it hamper any
attempt for the rebellion to spread from those to planets where
rebellion failed or never got going in the first place? I know
someone mentioned Blake giving the antidote to rebel groups,
but to spread the knowledge that widely would surely find it falling
straight into the hands of the Federation as well. And if he *didn’t*,
the Federation couldn’t use their military power to take back the
outer worlds, but neither could the rebellion strike at the heart
of the Federation. Stalemate...and though Dr Bellfriar may be gone,
the Federation would have plenty of other scientists to search for the
cure.

I shall now shut up for a while and learn to read threads *properly*
before joining in...


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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 22:25:16 +0100
From: "David A McIntee" <master@sol.co.uk>
To: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>, <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
Message-Id: <199908011018.LAA25691@gnasher.sol.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

----------
> From: Sally Manton <smanton@hotmail.com>
> <But (Blake’s) an unbalanced (Star One shows that) fanatic ->
> 
> Does not. And <g> no, I won't force you all to listen to me on the
> subject again. Blake was RIGHT about destroying Star One. 

I don't mean destroying Star Onje showed it - I mean his speech to Cally in
that episode "the only way to prove that I was right" or words to that
effect) proves it.

> Letting a plague loose on the galaxy - simply to kill Servalan (!) - is a
> *completely* different kettle of poisoned fish.

Not just Servalan, but all the thugs and bully boys, all the warlords, all
the torturers and oppressors...

> Yes, I do believe Avon might have done it. There isn't anyone
> outside the Liberator (that we know of - he thinks both of the
> Grants were dead at this stage) that he cares enough about to put
> their lives ahead of getting rid of Servalan and her people. As far
> as he is concerned, the whole human race can go to hell in a
> high-tech handcart for the sake of the few people who matter to him.
> 

Avon needs an audience. He needs people to see how superior he is.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:18:27 +1000
From: Kathryn Andersen <kat@welkin.apana.org.au>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Possible Federation Ender....
Message-ID: <19990801131827.A8523@welkin.apana.org.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

On Sat, Jul 31, 1999 at 11:25:47AM -0700, Hellen Paskaleva wrote:
> Kathryn, RE my thoughts concerning the plague in "Killer:
> 
> > > ...Viruses usually affect the
> > > one's body, linking to the one's DNA. Therefore, it is needed deep space
> > > trips to cause some kind of mutations in the human's DNA (which 
> >mutation, as
> > > a feature, to be "recognised" and affected by the virus).
> >
> >This is what Dr. Bellfriar said about the virus:
> >"Everyone who's been into deep space has had the Terran (PL)ague..."
> 
> ><snip, because all of us are well awared of the script>

Well, I wasn't sure if you *were* aware of the exact wording of the
script.  I don't expect people to have it memorised, you know...
 
> I *do* know Dr. Bellfriar's opinion. What *I* am saying is, that the 
> explanation is SCIENTIFICALY incorrect. We have to pay attention to author's 
> viewpoint, but we *MUST* differ the improbable from the impossible.

Okay, so how would you change canon to make it scientifically correct?
You can argue, from within canon, that Dr. Bellfriar was already
infected, and that his brain was a bit woozy, and he was trying to
explain to the layman so he oversimplified, but that doesn't mean, if
you actually do wish to argue within canon (since that is the name of
the game) that every single thing he said can be ignored.
So, given that, what *could* be the real properties of the virus?
It is still probably a reasonable supposition that it was engineered
by the inhabitants of 61 Cygni to infect those who found the derelict
spaceship.  It's also reasonable that it *is* a virus.  It also has
certain symptoms, that can't be argued with either.  And the Terran
Ague (not Plague) is something that everyone who travels into space
gets, whatever it is.  Perhaps the Terran Ague is a reaction to Deep
Space, or perhaps it's a reaction to prolonged exposure to the FTL
drives that everyone uses.  Whatever it is, from its name, "Terran
Ague" and "Three Day Sweats", it sounds like the most common symptom
is a high fever of relatively short duration.  (my trusty dictionary
describes "ague" as "1. malarial fever with successive stages of fever
and chills. 2. a fit of shivvering. [from Old French (fievre) ague
acute fever]" so it seems reasonable that it's an acute fever.)

So, oh expert, what is the answer?

-- 
 _--_|\	    | Kathryn Andersen		<kat@welkin.apana.org.au>
/      \    | 		http://home.connexus.net.au/~kat
\_.--.*/    | #include "standard/disclaimer.h"
      v	    |
------------| Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia -> Southern Hemisphere
Maranatha!  |	-> Earth -> Sol -> Milky Way Galaxy -> Universe

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:59:23 -0700
From: kalazar <kalazar@earthlink.net>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Where is Freedom city?
Message-ID: <37A4A71B.4D2591F1@earthlink.net>
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Hi! Sorry to bother this list but I'm really lost and confused. I was on
the SC list which went to Onelist as FreedomCity and then it was to move
again? and now I have received 0 posts from neither SC nor FC. Can
anyone help me Please?????

Kalazar
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End of blakes7-d Digest V99 Issue #236
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