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blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 15
Today's Topics:
[B7L] Lemme tell you what *Like a Virgin'*s about...
[B7L] editing on Volcano/DotG tape?
[B7L] Re: Beards and the silly season
Re: [B7L] The Way Back 4/4
[B7L] Tyce
Re: [B7L] Re: Beards and the silly season
Re: re[B7L] The City at the edge of the World
Liberator
[B7L] Blake's Charisma
[B7L] Tyce Sarkoff, Charisma
Re: [B7L] Liberator
Re: [B7L] Tyce Sarkoff, Charisma
[B7L] Re: Iain's beard
Re: re[B7L] The City at the edge of the World
[B7L] PD Chat
Re: [B7L] PD Chat
[B7L] The Way Back or Blake's Charisma
Re: [B7L] PD Chat
Re: [B7L] editing on Volcano/DotG tape?
[B7L] London drink
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 10:54:20 +0000
From: Russ Massey <russ@wriding.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Lemme tell you what *Like a Virgin'*s about...
Message-ID: <UhCZdCAcxzv0EwA+@wriding.demon.co.uk>
Amother (fairly short) comment from Neil on the techniques of dramatic
writing. Probably best not to be eating anything when you reach the last
paragraph.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"LEMME TELL YOU WHAT *LIKE A VIRGIN*'S ABOUT..."
by Neil Faulkner (from Altazine #1)
I've yet to meet anyone who's seen *Pulp Fiction* and not been totally
bowled over by it, though no doubt such miserable souls exist. *Reservoir
Dogs* does seem to have gained a few detractors - I've met one woman who
walked out in the middle of *that* scene, and someone else who nearly
switched his video off. But they are exceptions. Nearly everyone else seems
to have been as captivated as I was by the deliberately disjointed narrative
structure, superb dialogue, and steadily widening cracks in the hollow mask
of machismo. Tarantino scoops up media conventions and gleefully
remoulds them, placing flashbacks in flashbacks, abruptly changing the
music halfway through the opening titles, sticking the middle of the story at
the end of the film because the middle is so much more dramatic.
I was forcefully reminded of B7 halfway through *Pulp Fiction*, when Uma
Thurman tells John Travolta about the undeveloped TV pilot she appeared in.
*Fox Force Five* - five foxy chicks who were a force to be reckoned with,
and each had her own special area of expertise. Blatantly formulaic, reeking
of two-D characterisation, high-tech glam, and weekly repeated ritual <a sort
of US *Bugs*, in fact! - sorry, mustn't interrupt... Russ>. Take a Leader as a
focal point, throw in a Computer Expert, a Leggy Pilot, a Strongman, a Witty
Thief, and a Token Alien, have them all carry the same type of weapon and
wear the same design of parka, give them all teleport bracelets and make sure
they say 'Down and safe' whenever they zap down to some chalkpit
masquerading as an alien world. To say it sucks would be an understatement.
It's a tribute to B7 that it managed to rise above such nonsense, if only to a
limited extent.
The other day I finally got to see the pilot for *Star Trek: Voyager*. As a
piece of Trek it wasn't too bad (Criminals? Outlaws? Good grief - a few
more spinoffs and the Federation might even end up as the bad guys) but the
deadly spectre of *Fox Force Five* was grimly overshadowing every other
turn of the plot. Sworn enemies rushed to save each other from Certain
Death, deadly races against time were won in the Last Vital Second, the
starship captain made a Terrible Decision and the crew didn't even think of
lynching her afterwards. Not a murmur as she declared the nature of the
Noble Quest that lay ahead of them. Not even a murmur that it was all her
bloody fault (she wouldn't last ten seconds in a rolegaming campaign - "You
****ing bitch! We wanted to go home!" Blamm-Zap-Kapow and I'm looting
the body).
Media science fiction is rooted in a sense of tradition, ritualised to the point
of being quasi-religious. B7 subverted the conventions to an extent, and I
gather that *Babylon-5* is doing the same (no telly, can't watch it). But even
then, they only bend the rules. Tarantino has shown that it is possible to
break the rules, and that audiences out there want the rules to be broken.
They want to laugh as they squirm at the sight of some poor cop getting his
ear hacked off, or listen to two professional killers discussing the pros and
cons of eating pork. They want blatant references to 'dead niggers' and long-
winded crap analyses of Madonna singles. A little dictum I've formulated,
one of those pithy sayings that gets me labelled as intellectually pretentious
(maybe because I am) - a good film doesn't give the audience what they
want, it gives them what they didn't know they wanted. It's harder, and
riskier, than going through the same old motions time after time, but it's worth
a whole batch of duds if it throws up the odd *Pulp Fiction*.
Since AltaZine is supposed to be the B7 Fanfic Letterzine, I'll get mega-
pretentious and say that I reckon that a good fan story is, likewise, one that
gives the readers something they didn't know they wanted. By that reckoning,
there's a real dearth of good stories, and a serious shortage of good fan
writers. Fanfic is firmly chained to the rituals of repetition. The writers
disgorge by rote, the readers meekly swallow. Not a bad analogy, really.
There are times when reading a fanzine can seem like eating vomit. Is this
really what fans want? Is there scope for breaking free of the bounds of
convention? We can, without a doubt, carry on blissfully, ploughing through
the same old saga of inter-character bickerings and smoulderings, heavy-
handed reconciliations and all the other trite paraphernalia of fanfic.
On the other hand, we could always bring out the Gimp...
--
transcribed by
Russ Massey
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:11:49 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] editing on Volcano/DotG tape?
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980116090847.25684F-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Someone just asked me this and [begin agonized overacting]
I can't remember! [end angst]
Have the episodes "Volcano" and "Dawn of the Gods" been cut
on the professional tapes? The box doesn't have the usual "unedited"
banner in the corner.
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:14:49 -0500
From: Harriet Monkhouse <H_F_Monkhouse@compuserve.com>
To: "Blake's 7 (Lysator)" <BLAKES7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Re: Beards and the silly season
Message-ID: <199801160915_MC2-2F81-796A@compuserve.com>
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Fran wrote in support of beards, but added:
>I also like hairy chests. (On men, that is).
Oh, no, I draw the line at hairy chests. Facial hair good, chest hair
horrible. No offence meant.
Harriet
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:52:43 -0000
From: "Jenni-Alison" <Jenni-Alison@dial.pipex.com>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] The Way Back 4/4
Message-Id: <199801161451.PAA28030@samantha.lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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I agree with Lisa, that Blake has lots of Charisma. I thing GT did a
great job of portraying a man who was driven to fight for what he
believed in, and moved those around through sheer force of
personality to fight for the same thing, and for him.
But is charisma in the eye of the beholder? There's a sales manager
at my work who's said to have it - most of the company would throw
themselves off buildings if he asked them to - me? I'm more likely
to throw myself at him with an
axe or a chainsaw...
Jenni
----------
> From: Lisa Williams <lcw@dallas.net>
> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
> Subject: Re: [B7L] The Way Back 4/4
> Date: 16 January 1998 02:23
>
> Pat Patera wrote:
>
> >Charisma is a strange thing. It's also called "star quality." And
no,
> >alas, Blake does not have it.
>
> Interesting. I always regarded Blake as having *lots* of charisma,
and had
> no trouble at all understanding why people would follow him, even
against
> their better judgement. I could feel it myself.
>
> --
> - Lisa
> <lcw@dallas.net>
> <lwilliams@mcopn1.dseg.ti.com>
> Lisa's Frame Capture Library: http://lcw
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 04:08:21 +1100
From: Fran Myers <algemy@ozemail.com.au>
To: B7 <blake7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Tyce
Message-ID: <34BF9405.2A44@ozemail.com.au>
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Sarkoff is one of my favourite guest characters, and I like Tyce too.
Judith sez:> Huh? I never saw that. I just assumed she was his
bodyguard and that she> knew him well. I never saw a sexual
relationship implied.
>
I agree totally. Men have such tender egos, it would be difficult for
Sarkoff to maintain a sexual relationship with someone who spent all her
time putting him down.
Fran M
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:08:16 -0500 (EST)
From: adering@ziplink.net (Alex Dering)
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Beards and the silly season
Message-Id: <v01000001b0e50bd5e4d0@[208.196.104.63]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 9:14 AM on 1/16/98, Harriet Monkhouse wrote:
> Fran wrote in support of beards, but added:
> >I also like hairy chests. (On men, that is).
>
> Oh, no, I draw the line at hairy chests. Facial hair good, chest hair
> horrible. No offence meant.
>
> Harriet
Harriet, it's not like I got a choice in the matter :)
And, according to people I've spoken to, I can expect my chest hair to turn
gray as I age. Well, at least I know what to buy myself on my 30th birthday
(coming up in a few months!): a hair electrolysis kit.
Down and hairy, I mean, down and safe,
Alex
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 12:08:49 -0600
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: re[B7L] The City at the edge of the World
Message-ID: <01bd22a9$cba2bf60$12b34dc6@penguin>
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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><< I'm sorry, but Vila's first loyalty
> should have been to his crewmate, not his new drinking pal. >>
>
> I agree. It's just that I don't see any conflict of interest here in
Vila
>watching after Doran. After all, there is really nothing on this world that
>would have particullary appealed to Vila, so I don't see him anxious to
stay.
>And considering that Tarrant was spectacularly unsuccessful in
> accomplishing anything, it might have behooved him to have let Vila have
> his head for a bit, to see what came of it.
Considering what Vila (not every time, but most) tended to accomplish when
given his head, I thought Tarrant should have had him on much shorter leash
than he did.
> As ref the transcripts, I agree that they do not mention motive. But
then
>again, there are frequently motives that are not explicitly stated in the
>series that can be deduced. Such are the stuff fanfic are made of!
In fanfic, yes. But in this particular *episode,* I see no evidence from
which these motives can be deduced.
Lorna B.
"You ever flown a flying saucer? After that, sex seems trite."
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 13:48:33 -0000
From: "Stephen Shaw" <stephenshaw@lineone.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>, <blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Liberator
Message-ID: <01bd21bc$45cd69a0$LocalHost@default>
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Does anyone know where I can find any decent pic of the Liberator? The only
decent one was a computer generated image. Also what happened to the model
of the ship at the end of the 3rd season?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:55:40 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Blake's Charisma
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.09-0116075540-d07Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1
On Wed 14 Jan, Pat Patera wrote:
> Charisma is a strange thing. It's also called "star quality." And no,
> alas, Blake does not have it.
I'm reminded of something said recently on the other list. The writer said
that she'd tried listening to the episodes on audio tape and found that they
had a very different effect on her.
When you have Blake's voice and words without the detraction of Avon's
sneers, Vila's dubious looks, etc., the effect is much stronger.
The way that we judge charisma is inevitably affected by the reactions of
others and if the rest of the crew are seen as largely unaffected, then the
impact on us will be correspondingly reduced.
Judith
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7
Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention
26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent
http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 12:01:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Tyce Sarkoff, Charisma
Message-ID: <Megw.4779906@powell.fabrik.com>
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I long ago concluded that I could stand in front of a stop
sign with someone, and see something which did not match what
they saw. I still say Tyce was shrill, her voice
irritating.
I don't disagree that she was beautiful and
strong. Of course she was. I just didn't like her. As for my
impression that she was being offered as Sarkoff's lover, my
undergrad degree is in theatre arts, and I see body language and
blocking as meaning something other people may not see. My
daughter won't watch plays with me because I'm always commenting
sotto voce about what the director is saying. In this case, I
believed that a show otherwise being offered to children was
being aimed at adults as well with a typical older man-younger
woman relationship. Obviously, I was wrong. It ticked me off,
because it seemed deliberately misleading. The fact that someone
else didn't see what I saw does not invalidate what I actually
did see. This is one of those interpretation things, just like
the mater of Blake's charisma.
I have no problem with Blake. I think he's very attractive
and tormented by a need to "fix" something which is probably not
fixable by a small band of outlaws. I just dont' think he's Che
Guevara. It doesn't seem to matter whether I listen without
watching or not. (I do that a lot. I like to have "company"
when I'm alone in the house, unless I'm writing.)
It doesn't surprise me to find myself standing in a minority
position here, that happens to me all the time. I doesn't
mean my position is invalid.
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:18:26 +0100
From: "Jeroen J. Kwast" <jeroenkw@gns.getronics.nl>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Liberator
Message-ID: <34BFC092.C80@gns.getronics.nl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Stephen Shaw wrote:
>
> Does anyone know where I can find any decent pic of the Liberator? The only
> decent one was a computer generated image. Also what happened to the model
> of the ship at the end of the 3rd season?
I have one of those questions,
Does anyone have ANY Lightwave models of the Liberator, scorpio
space hq persuitships (federation/spaceworld)
I have a lot of babylon 7 models and making a movie (sort of) of them.
I would like to do the same with my favourite show.
If anyone has a model or knows someone who has/can make/use magic please
tell me !!!!
Jeroen
PS: This is not a desperate note ........ wait until you get the next
one :)
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:28:01 GMT
From: Iain Coleman <ijc@mail.nerc-bas.ac.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce Sarkoff, Charisma
Message-Id: <19160.9801162028@bsauasc.nerc-bas.ac.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Md5: O9MGAy2ZT+aMHQVmw1Xc9w==
Patti wrote:
> I don't disagree that she was beautiful and
> strong. Of course she was. I just didn't like her. As for my
> impression that she was being offered as Sarkoff's lover, my
> undergrad degree is in theatre arts, and I see body language and
> blocking as meaning something other people may not see. My
> daughter won't watch plays with me because I'm always commenting
> sotto voce about what the director is saying.
Oh, I know the feeling. I've done a fair bit of acting, and it's made it
difficult for me to watch plays/TV/movies, because I get distracted from the
show by thinking "hmm, that was a nice reaction" or "ooh, what a horrible line
reading". Most irritating. I wish I could switch that bit of my brain off while
I'm being entertained.
Iain
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:27:11 EST
From: penny_kjelgaard@juno.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Re: Iain's beard
Message-ID: <19980116.122203.18119.2.Penny_Kjelgaard@juno.com>
Iain wrote:
>Thanks, my poor ego feels much better now.
>:-#
>(that's my pitiful attempt at a bearded smiley)
>(hmm, that sounds a bit rude)
Now, Iain, we love you with or without your beard.
Penny
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:55:03 -0600
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: re[B7L] The City at the edge of the World
Message-ID: <01bd22c1$04297420$12b34dc6@penguin>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hmm! I think my last post may have been supposed to go privately to Deborah
Rose, in which case I apologize. I'm trying a new mailer (a real
pain-in-the-ass mailer, IMO) and thought it was "just another glitch" that I
couldn't get my reply to automatically go to the list.
Sorry, Deborah Rose!
Lorna B.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:29:43 -0600 (CST)
From: "G. Robbins" <robbins@graceland.edu>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] PD Chat
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980116151933.19401A-100000@inet-ux.graceland.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
I thought you might like to know that they have the transcript of the
online chat with Paul Darrow at
http://www.oi.beeb.com/chat/transcripts/pages/980116_blake/index.html
I finally figured out how to insert questions for the chat before they
went on, so I got some of my questions answered. Sorry I didn't get the
chance to explain to y'all...I didn't think it had worked myself.
**IMMENSE GLOATING**
Wondering how I won the cassettes for "Blake's 7" 'The Sevenfold
Crown'...by random drawing or the wit of my questions!!
Grace Robbins
robbins@inet-ux.graceland.edu
http://www.graceland.edu/~robbins
-----------------------------
"Well, it wouldn't be called "Blake's 7" if I had my way. It would be
called something like "Avon's Angels" and it would be me surrounded by
stacks of gorgeous women."
-Paul Darrow
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:26:46 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] PD Chat
Message-ID: <bQ8WlDAm69v0EwD2@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <Pine.HPP.3.96.980116151933.19401A-100000@inet-
ux.graceland.edu>, "G. Robbins" <robbins@graceland.edu> writes
<snip>
>
>"Well, it wouldn't be called "Blake's 7" if I had my way. It would be
>called something like "Avon's Angels" and it would be me surrounded by
>stacks of gorgeous women."
> -Paul Darrow
>
>
Hmm. Sounds like a good description of a typical sight at a con with
Paul as a guest.
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 17:46:30 -0800
From: Rhonda L Stroud <rstroud@halcyon.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] The Way Back or Blake's Charisma
Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980117014630.006742b0@mail.halcyon.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
I just wanted to clarify a point. I didn't mean say that Blake had no
charisma at all, I just meant that he didn't have the type of charisma that
stood on it's own. The attraction of Blake is very much the attraction of
his call. He is appealing because he comes across as a bright man who is
good (in the traditional meaning) and has a vision of a promised land and
the practical talent to lead people there.
He doesn't have the Adolf Hitler or Jack Kennedy-type of charisma where it
doesn't matter what opinions he espouses -- the mob will follow. And if
they want to use a "nation of people" to carry out personal vendettas, so be
it. It isn't Blake's style. He may have the ability to attract a mob of
zombies which will who do his bidding, but he wouldn't want them anyway.
Because he is a very ethical person at heart. Yes, I know, there is Star
One, but he was deeply despairing by then, and was ready to put the dagger
into the heart of the Federation to justify all the sacrifices his followers
had made up until that time.
As ever,
rs
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 17:49:36 -0800
From: Rhonda L Stroud <rstroud@halcyon.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] PD Chat
Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980117014936.006847d0@mail.halcyon.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 10:26 PM 1/16/98 +0000, you wrote:
>In message <Pine.HPP.3.96.980116151933.19401A-100000@inet-
>ux.graceland.edu>, "G. Robbins" <robbins@graceland.edu> writes
><snip>
>>
>>"Well, it wouldn't be called "Blake's 7" if I had my way. It would be
>>called something like "Avon's Angels" and it would be me surrounded by
>>stacks of gorgeous women."
>> -Paul Darrow
Avon's Angels?? Oh, my, I think Mr. Darrow is stuck in the seventies...:-)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 13:17:05 +1100 (EST)
From: Gordon Burgess & Carol Mason <gcb7@magna.com.au>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] editing on Volcano/DotG tape?
Message-Id: <199801170217.NAA20637@magna.com.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>At 09:11 AM 1/16/98 -0500, you wrote:
>> Someone just asked me this and [begin agonized overacting]
>>I can't remember! [end angst]
>>
>> Have the episodes "Volcano" and "Dawn of the Gods" been cut
>>on the professional tapes? The box doesn't have the usual "unedited"
>>banner in the corner.
>>
>>Sue
>>sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
>>
Hi, it must have only been printed on some cover boxes as my copy (
Australian ) does not have it printed on at all. I Know as our copies are
not uncut, I suppose you could look at the running time, you might be able
to work our from that if any tapes have been cut.
Catch you later,
"Hondo"
Take care, Peace be with you,
Carol "Hondo" Mason
<gcb7@magna.com.au>
"Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity"
"Everyone has a photographic memory. Some just don't have film"
"Friends may come and go, but enemies tend to accumlate"
"If you can't convince them, confuse them"
"Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk"
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 12:18:32 +0100 GMT
From: STEVE.ROGERSON@MCR1.poptel.org.uk
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
CC: space-city@world.std.com
Subject: [B7L] London drink
Message-Id: <198215085MCR1@MCR1.poptel.org.uk>
We haven't a drink in Pages bar (the sci-fi bar) in London for a
while. Anyone fancy changing this on Saturday Feb 7? The
reason I'm suggesting that date is there is also a sci-fi fair in
London that day. This is at Westminster Central Hall, Storey's
Gate and is a short walk from Pages. These fairs are basically
just giant dealer halls (170 tables). It runs from 11 to 4, time
then for something to eat and off to Pages for the evening. Drop
us a line if you are coming.
cheers
Steve Rogerson
Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention
26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent
http://www.smof.com/redemption/
Make your own tribble! Buy a hamster and cut off its legs
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #15
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