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blakes7-d Digest Volume 00 : Issue 16
Today's Topics:
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] socks
[B7L] Re: blakes7-d Digest V00 #14
Re: [B7L] socks
[B7L] Neil vs. Mistral
Re: [B7L] Too quiet
[B7L] drugs
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
Re: [B7L] Too quiet
Re: [B7L] socks
Re: [B7L] socks
Re: [B7L] socks
[B7L] Civil War
Re: [B7L] drugs
Re: [B7L] Civil War
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
Re: [B7L] The Limiter
Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
[B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
[B7L] need download echo site tested
Re: [B7L] socks
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Re: [B7L] Many many people...
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 19:51:47 +0000
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <DsszwXATL3g4EwLw@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <20000117152929.69015.qmail@hotmail.com>, Hellen Paskaleva
<hellen_pas@hotmail.com> writes
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Julia Jones
>>
>> >I am not aware that there was large scale compulsory use of pacifying
>> >drugs in the Soviet Union.
>
>...But I am. They just weren't described as such. People, who dared to voice
>their disagreement with the system, had been sent either into concentration
>camps (as criminals), or in mental clinics (as suffering from mental
>diseases). Moreover, you do not need any complicated drugs for that - a bit
>higher quantities of anyu simple Bromide salt works perfectly for
>suppressing the will.
>
we're thinking different things by large-scale here. The general
population in the dome is drugged with something added to the food and
water supply, presumably with a small minority being exempt and having
access to undrugged supplies.
My understanding of what happened in the Soviet Union was that it was
only a minority of the total population who were subjected to this, the
example being enough for everybody else.
It might interest people to know that here in the UK the government is
planning to allow people to be locked up even though they have committed
no crime and cannot be sectioned under the mental health act. If
psychiatrists deem you to be a potential danger to other people, you can
be put away to protect society, even if you are no danger to yourself,
do not have a treatable mental illness, and have never committed a
crime.the the the room
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 20:16:48 +0000
From: Nicola Collie <nicola@dunedinite.free-online.co.uk>
To: Lysator <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-Id: <l03130304b4a927cad6f1@[131.111.99.170]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Judith said:
>My first guess was that it might derive from 'jumbuck' (aussie slang for a
>sheep), but in fact, it comes from 'jump' a 19C loose jacket, which comes from
>the French 'jupe' which comes from the Arabic 'jubbah' - a long cloth coat.
My goodness, those etymologists must have been canny tailors :) From a long
coat we get a skirt (jupe), a jacket, a knitted gament for the torso and a
sleeveless dress worn over a blouse. All we needs is shoes and a handbag
and we'd have an entire outfit!
ObB7 - all the clothes in the Liberator clothing room were identical, and
assumed the appearance we see after tuning in to the mental state of the
first person to put them on. This might explain a few of the sillier
outfits ;)
Nicola
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 07:58:54 +1100
From: Jenny Pausacker <jaynova@bigpond.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Re: blakes7-d Digest V00 #14
Message-Id: <20562787608334@domain1.bigpond.com>
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Sally wrote:
>Does anyone know how tall Our Heroes actually are?
Seconded, especially in regard to either Vila or Michael Keating. I've
locked myself into giving Vila's exact height in a story I'm writing, which
means that, just for once, I need to break my own personal rule that says I
don't acknowledge the existence of those actor people. (Blake & Co are
real, I tell you! Real!! As real as I am: although some days, of course,
that's not exceptionally real.) Can anyone help with this, please? (The
Keating height problem, I mean, not my reality deficit.)
Thanks,
Jenny.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 08:33:34 EST
From: "Joanne MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-ID: <20000117213334.85511.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: Nicola Collie <nicola@dunedinite.free-online.co.uk>
>ObB7 - all the clothes in the Liberator clothing room were identical, and
>assumed the appearance we see after tuning in to the mental state of the
>first person to put them on. This might explain a few of the sillier
>outfits ;)
<direction to self> No, don't do it, don't even attempt to consider what
frame of mind prompted that Deathwatch costume, don't do it.
Regards
Joanne
(just don't do it...)
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 15:27:10 -0700
From: Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Neil vs. Mistral
Message-ID: <388396BA.51B6@jps.net>
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> Hmm. Do you really think I'm more misanthropic than you?
> Perhaps we should get your friends and my friends together
> and let them discuss it.
If anyone shows up, you'll both have to forfeit the title.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 23:32:44 -0000
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 List" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Too quiet
Message-ID: <000001bf6134$9f7fa6c0$9c8201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
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>Andrew Ellis wrote:
>> I don't think that Vila was that subservient.
>> Mistral said
>Ah. I never think of Vila as subservient. But in any close
>relationship one partner is dominant (although it sometimes
>trades off, in the more equal ones.) I don't think you can
>really say that in A-V, Vila is the dominant one.
>
>Grins,
>Mistral
>--
Provided you agree that Vila chose to allow Avon to be dominant, I agree.
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 15:44:18 -0700
From: Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] drugs
Message-ID: <388398E1.108@jps.net>
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> ..But I am. They just weren't described as such. People, who dared to voice
> their disagreement with the system, had been sent either into concentration
> camps (as criminals), or in mental clinics (as suffering from mental
> diseases). Moreover, you do not need any complicated drugs for that - a bit
> higher quantities of anyu simple Bromide salt works perfectly for
> suppressing the will.
>
> Hellen
So that's what Christopher Lee was talking about in his autobiography.
In his public school days, they kept the lads' sex drive down with
bromides in their tea. Didn't seem to surpress his will very well,
though, he was constantly being beaten for any number of wilful
troublemaking.
Which ties in with Blake's 7-- the drugs in the domes (vs. the later
Pylene-50) don't seem incredibly reliable. Of course, we don't know who,
specifically they were used on, and people make all kinds of guesses,
but there's certainly enough indications of criminal activity still
existing that the people are not extremely well-controlled. How much
does individual temperment play a factor in resistance to such drugs?
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 23:04:11 -0000
From: "Alison Page" <alison@alisonpage.demon.co.uk>
To: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <006601bf613f$467d1660$ca8edec2@pre-installedco>
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julia, hellen
>>> >I am not aware that there was large scale compulsory use of pacifying
>>> >drugs in the Soviet Union.
>>
>>...But I am. They just weren't described as such. People, who dared to
voice
>>their disagreement with the system, had been sent either into
concentration
>>camps (as criminals), or in mental clinics (as suffering from mental
>>diseases)
This goes on in the west too though, of course. Here's one report from
Canada (I am not in the least suggesting that Canada is worse in this
respect than other western countries - probably just have some open
government law that makes these things more public):
" Although the patient was prepared by prolonged sensory isolation (35 days)
(*1) and by repeated depatterning (*2) and although she received 101 days of
positive driving (*3), no favourable results were obtained"
(*1) this being suspension in a float tank, in the dark, in silence, for
five weeks
(*2) alternation of drugged sleep and electroshock and sometimes
hallucinogens
(*3) the patient is bombarded with repeated negative statements played on a
looped tape at high volume
This example was not a terrorist, or even a member of a dissident
organisation, it was one 'Mary C' diagnosed as exhibiting "conversion
reaction in a woman of the involutional age (ie menopause) with mental
anxiety and hypochondria" an inconvenient, complaining, middle aged woman in
other words.
I think this compares very much with what was done to Blake, and I think it
shows that we should not be complacent in the west that our political or
psychiatric regimes differ greatly from the eastern bloc or indeed the
federation.
Alison
if anyone wants to check this, you might chase the following ref (I haven't
though)
'Intensive Electroconvulsive therapy: a follow-up study" Schwartzman and
Termansen. Canadian Psychiatric association, Volume 12, 1967.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 23:04:21 -0000
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <00ec01bf613f$aedb3a20$9c8201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain;
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>>
>> >I am not aware that there was large scale compulsory use of pacifying
>> >drugs in the Soviet Union.
>
>...But I am. They just weren't described as such. People, who dared to
voice
>their disagreement with the system, had been sent either into concentration
>camps (as criminals), or in mental clinics (as suffering from mental
>diseases). Moreover, you do not need any complicated drugs for that - a bit
>higher quantities of anyu simple Bromide salt works perfectly for
>suppressing the will.
>
>Hellen
>______________________________________________________
I stand corrected.
But this targeted use of drugs is more what I thought the Federation was
into, rather than the "its in the food chain" type mass drugging.
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 23:27:41 +0000
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Cc: lysator <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <bBjlLMAtV6g4Ewa2@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <006601bf613f$467d1660$ca8edec2@pre-installedco>, Alison Page
<alison@alisonpage.demon.co.uk> writes
>I think this compares very much with what was done to Blake, and I think it
>shows that we should not be complacent in the west that our political or
>psychiatric regimes differ greatly from the eastern bloc or indeed the
>federation.
Prozac.
That stuff they feed hyperactive children, definition of "hyperactive"
in some cases including "brighter than the teacher". (Yes, I know it can
be very helpful in genuine cases of hyperactivity.)
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 14:48:48 -0700
From: "Ellynne G." <rilliara@juno.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
Message-ID: <20000117.165624.8750.0.Rilliara@juno.com>
On Sun, 16 Jan 2000 14:57:29 -0500 Susan Beth
<susanbeth33@mindspring.com> writes:
>I've always thought that Gan was a lab rat for a new procedure
>
>If you want to make the Feds a bit less cynical in their use of him,
>Gan
>may have "volunteered" for the operation. As in, he was sentenced to
>death
>originally, but if he volunteered (and survived it), they would
>commute it
>to exile. <shrug>
This last makes particularly good sense because of Gan's attitude. There
was something matter of fact in his attitude about his limitor that works
better with his either having had some choice in the matter or
recognizing it as the lesser of two evils.
For those who insist on the Federation being evil, perhaps this was one
of those scientists or doctors (possibly the wishy-washy kind) who have a
conscience but don't buck the system. He or she felt Gan deserved a
chance at survival and either drafted him for the experiment or directly
approached him and asked him to volunteer (since Gan was charged with
killing a rapist, a woman scientist might be particularly sympathetic to
him).
OTOH, there's something about this that doesn't make me think Gan was a
lab rat--or not _just_ a lab rat--although I can't quite put my finger on
it.
Limiters were either new or not commonly known outside certain circles.
Jenna, who should have been reasonably aware of Federtion penalties
needed a fair amount of explanation. But a nonFederation surgeon could be
expected to know how to deal with one.
Blake thought they could pass the limitor off as normal, but (again) a
nonFederation physician realized it would not be implanted in a
Federation ship's crew.
We would normally expect Gan's 'crime' to merit death in the Federation.
Conversely, if the Federation judged him criminally insane (or something
akin to it), justifying implanting the limitor, we would expect that to
be his punishment.
Hmm, I suppose it works if the limitor was similar to other types of
implants used to control more normal brain problems (seizures, for
example). Then a surgeon from any advanced world could be expected to
know about them in general and how to deal with them. The problem being
they got a guy with proFederation leanings who was smart enough to
realize in detail what Gan's limitor did and that this wasn't consistant
with Blake's cover story.
But I still have the feeling I'm missing an interesting story thread
possibility.
Ellynne
________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 16:11:28 -0800
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Too quiet
Message-ID: <3883AFB0.53F3C01F@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Andrew Ellis wrote:
> Provided you agree that Vila chose to allow Avon to be dominant, I agree.
Oh, absolutely. Some people are more comfortable in a non-dominant
role, and Vila is one of them. He can still take charge when needed,
and he's brilliant in his field (which Avon recognizes). The reason
they play so well together is because they're *both* comfortable
with the way their relationship is sorted out. Vila does let Avon
boss him around, but *only so far*.
Mistral
--
"Who do you serve? And who do you trust?"
--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 16:22:06 -0800
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-ID: <3883B22E.998B026@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Joanne MacQueen wrote:
> <direction to self> No, don't do it, don't even attempt to consider what
> frame of mind prompted that Deathwatch costume, don't do it.
Whereas here I've been consciously trying to figure it out.
That and Vila's costume in Pressure Point.
<eg>
Mistral
P.S. BTW, Nicola, what a marvelous idea.
--
"Who do you serve? And who do you trust?"
--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 11:48:45 EST
From: "Joanne MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-ID: <20000118004846.37227.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: mistral@ptinet.net
>Joanne MacQueen wrote:
> > <direction to self> No, don't do it, don't even attempt to consider what
> > frame of mind prompted that Deathwatch costume, don't do it.
>Whereas here I've been consciously trying to figure it out.
Yes, well, I want to be able to sleep tonight, not think up
insomnia-inducing visions. Which might just be your answer, Mistral, if it
weren't for the fact that the Terminal costume is tame by comparison. If it
comes to that, what brought on that dark blue, three-quarter sleeved,
almighty collared tunic thing from the first season (Mission to Destiny,
amongst others)? It is a little odd <smile>
>P.S. BTW, Nicola, what a marvelous idea.
It stops continuity problems like Jenna's red leather outfit and Dayna's
white one-shouldered jumpsuit (ie how the heck did they get back on board
the Liberator?) quite nicely, too.
Regards
Joanne
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 18:16:05 -0800
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-ID: <3883CCE4.A0BF4619@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Joanne MacQueen wrote:
> If it
> comes to that, what brought on that dark blue, three-quarter sleeved,
> almighty collared tunic thing from the first season (Mission to Destiny,
> amongst others)? It is a little odd <smile>
Why, that's obviously Avon's idea of what the well-dressed
computer specialist wears. Your basic business attire--dark
trousers, cuffed shirt, overtunic. He's simply snazzed it up a
little with a larger than usual collar and some bias trim. Very
much the thirtieth-century nerd with delusions of importance.
(Seriously, I suspect he started out wearing clothes that were
at least somewhat similar to what he was used to, then started
branching out as he became more comfortable around the others.
<g> He was awfully comfortable in Shadow, wasn't he?)
Mistral
--
"Who do you serve? And who do you trust?"
--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 20:21:28 -0700
From: "Ellynne G." <rilliara@juno.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Civil War
Message-ID: <20000117.202131.10702.0.Rilliara@juno.com>
Civil War: a part of a country, usually recognized as being on equal
footing with the rest of it, goes to war with either the powers that be
or with another part of the country which may not have recognized
authority over them. They are led by local, legitimate government and
their reasons for the war usually have some legitimate basis (though it
may be debateable or a reason locally recognized but not nationally).
Rebellion: people at war with the powers that be.
So, you _can_ have a civil war that isn't a rebellion (Bleeding Kansas,
where pro-slavery and anti-slavery factions tried to intimidate each
other with high casualties), and a rebellion that isn't a civil war (the
American Revolution), as well as having revolutions that are also civil
wars (the American Civil War).
So, Blake was a rebel but he would have needed more widespread fighting
or open support to count as a civil war. If more planets and their
governors had been able to openly support hime, he probably would have
counted, or if he had had a legitimate basis for declaring himself a
government in exile.
While I'm on this, is there any greater oxymoron than 'civil war'? Or has
any war ever been civil?
Ellynne
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:37:23 -0000
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] drugs
Message-ID: <0c8501bf617f$38b30360$0d01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Helen Krummenacker wrote:
> So that's what Christopher Lee was talking about in his autobiography.
> In his public school days, they kept the lads' sex drive down with
> bromides in their tea.
Didn't they do that in the army as well during the war? Probably still do
for all I know.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:36:24 -0000
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Civil War
Message-ID: <0c8401bf617f$3844ff50$0d01a8c0@hedge>
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Ellynne wrote:
> While I'm on this, is there any greater oxymoron than 'civil war'? Or has
> any war ever been civil?
I thought Teal and Vandor had it sussed.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 07:15:56 -0000
From: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <001201bf6184$d5635f20$e535fea9@neilfaulkner>
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Mistral wrote:
> Hmm. I suspect that hating you might be taking the easy way out.
Well, if you really want to do things the hard way...
> I'll have to pass. If it makes you happy, I could wish that you look
> out of your window and see a live dodo bird, when you have neither
> a camera nor witnesses.
At least it wouldn't fly away while I was hunting out my binoculars.
> Hmm. Do you really think I'm more misanthropic than you?
> Perhaps we should get your friends and my friends together
> and let them discuss it.
That might be difficult - I don't have any friends.
> > Comfort breeds complacency.
>
> A clever riposte, but illogical. You would prefer that people
> wait until they are drowning to learn to swim?
A clever analogy, but an inapplicable one, unless you think that
recreational insurrection can be practiced to perfection - with no
collateral damage - before embarking on the real thing. Goals can be decided
in advance, strategy and tactics can't. Unless your name is Douglas Haig,
perhaps.
> > I think it's clear that *in Blake's assessment* (c) could never exceed
(d),
> > therefore destroying Star One was justifiable as the quickest and most
> > certain means of bringing down Uncle Feddy.
>
> Yes. I agree completely with your analysis of the situation, and
> of Blake's assessment. Obviously, I am in the (c) approaches
> infinity camp.
Probably the root of our inability to agree on this matter.
> > If I say the album was 5317704 you should be able to work it out. Now,
> > which of their hits might have been written for 4th Season Avon?
>
> I can only think of a title that might refer to Servalan.
Carrie-Anne Servalan?
Neil
"The only good alien is a dead alien" - Ursula LeGuin
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 19:17:30 +0000 (GMT)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0117191730-ab5Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
On Sun 16 Jan, Neil Faulkner wrote:
> Mistral wrote
> > Something's been nagging at me about Gan for a couple of days.
> > Breakdown makes it seem as if installing a limiter might be a
> > tricky, expensive process. Why did they put one in Gan if they
> > were just going to ship him off to a penal colony? Do you suppose
> > he committed another crime later? Or did he have some important
> > status where he had to remain on Earth for a time, say, to train a
> > job replacement, before being shipped out? Who's thought about
> > this?
>
> You could always try reading 'A Casting of Swords' in Stadler Link (complete
> with typos, coz I'm double-lazy when it comes to proofreading my own
> stuff...)
Which can be bought via myself, Neil or Linda Knights. (Neil's too modest <big
grin> to mention that he has copies for sale.
There's a full contents list on http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 and possibly a
review.
Judith
PS. More reviews always appreciated. Whether you love a zine or hate it, I'll
be happy to have the review as long as it is informative.
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight )
Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 19:20:02 +0000 (GMT)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] The Limiter
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0117192002-354Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
On Mon 17 Jan, Kathryn Andersen wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 16, 2000 at 06:45:54PM -0700, Helen Krummenacker wrote:
> > > Why did they put one in Gan if they
> > > were just going to ship him off to a penal colony? Do you suppose
> > > he committed another crime later?
> >
> > Because the prison guards, baliff, etc. were terrified of him?
> >
> Tranquilizers would be cheaper.
I've always believed Gan to be immune to the drugs. I've followed this line in
a couple of stories, the first one that comes to mind is 'A Beth on the London'
in The Aquitar Files - see the links section on http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7
Judith
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight )
Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 21:46:49 +0000
From: Steve Kilbane <steve@whitecrow.demon.co.uk>
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Double Jeopardy???
Message-Id: <200001172146.VAA19163@whitecrow.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Something's been nagging at me about Gan for a couple of days.
> Breakdown makes it seem as if installing a limiter might be a
> tricky, expensive process. Why did they put one in Gan if they
> were just going to ship him off to a penal colony?
Maybe limiters are like staples: dead easy to whack one in, but a
real bugger to fix it once it's there.
steve
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 11:02:14 GMT
From: kminne@camtech.net.au (Ken Minne)
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Message-ID: <3882fad1.1634576@mail.camtech.net.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Good day all
On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 11:58:40 -0000, Neil Faulkner wrote:
>Ellynne wrote:
<snip discussion of need to nuke Japan>
>Were *both* bombings necessary, or was - as some factions of the
>anti-nuclear lobby maintain - the Nagasaki bomb dropped primarily to test
>it, even though Washington knew that Hirohito was already planning to
>surrender?
>
<Snip>
!!!!!!! I don't quite know whether to be ROFLAMO or just picking my
jaw off the keyboard.
If I have it correctly, the US tested the Fat Man (Nagasaki ) type
bomb first at the Trinity test in New Mexico because they were not
sure that it would work. The Little Boy bomb they dropped on Hirshima
they thought would work first time, and it did.
I find the suggestion that the Americans nuked Nagasaki to test a bomb
they already knew would work a little hard to take.
On the other hand, they might have meant that the the US wanted to
find out what the FAT MAN type bomb would do to a populated city.
Neil, could you please give a little more context to that claim by the
anti-nuke lobby?
Thanks,
Walter Minne
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 04:05:03 -0800
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Message-ID: <388456EE.A39ED4E3@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lost track of who this was, think it was Walter Minne
quoting Neil:
> >Were *both* bombings necessary, or was - as some factions of the
> >anti-nuclear lobby maintain - the Nagasaki bomb dropped primarily to test
> >it, even though Washington knew that Hirohito was already planning to
> >surrender?
Synchronistically, saw a blurb for a new book last week
(don't remember the title or author, sorry) based on some
recently declassified documents that indicate that Japan was
actually planning to escalate the conflict significantly.
Mistral
--
"Who do you serve? And who do you trust?"
--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 13:19:57 -0000
From: "Alison Page" <alison@alisonpage.demon.co.uk>
To: "B7 List" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Message-ID: <000e01bf61b6$de6b9d80$ca8edec2@pre-installedco>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>Synchronistically, saw a blurb for a new book last week
>(don't remember the title or author, sorry) based on some
>recently declassified documents that indicate that Japan was
>actually planning to escalate the conflict significantly.
>
>Mistral
Now that really is disinformation. I don't mean on Mistral's part, but on
the part of whoever started that story. Japan were planning to escalate the
war? In August 1945? Remember this is after VE day, so Germany had long
since surrendered and was occupied, and US forces were already on Japanese
soil (those southern islands, whose name I forget).
I don't doubt that - as in Europe in the months before the German
surrender - atrocities were continuing to be committed in the teeth of
defeat. It's cruel and irrational but it obviously happens. The quick defeat
of Japan at this stage obviously put a stop to these atrocities. But without
food, arms or men, Japan
were in no position to 'significantly escalate' the war in any way. And the
American authorities must have known this, as they had fairly good
intelligence, and their own troops were coming upon starving and demoralised
civilian populations.
Which makes one think - why is this clearly spurious information being made
'available' all of a sudden? What is the origin of this story? Was it being
put about at the time (in 1945) to justify the bombing?
Sorry this is off-topic.
Alison
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 08:47:03 -0700
From: The Doctor <doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
To: Una McCormack <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
Cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] need download echo site tested
Message-ID: <20000118084703.B12501@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Right mates.
Please test ftp://ftp.nl2k.ab.ca/pub/
Go to the Blakes 7 directory and raid.
I want to know 1) accessibility and 2) Speed.
--
God Queen and Country Member - Liberal International
Never Satan President and Republic This is doctor@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@nl2k.ab.ca
Society MUST be saved! Republics must dissolve.
Birthdate: 29 Jan 1969 born Redhill Surrey UK
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 18:47:07 +0000
From: Nicola Collie <nicola@dunedinite.free-online.co.uk>
To: Lysator <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] socks
Message-Id: <l03130300b4aa65729568@[212.159.73.161]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mistral:
>P.S. BTW, Nicola, what a marvelous idea.
<bowing>
Why, thank you :)
It's amazing what you can come up with when you're trying to get a
discussion back on topic...
Nicola
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:06:17 -0000
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <0f4a01bf61e8$13987a10$0d01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Neil wrote:
> That might be difficult - I don't have any friends.
Don't be silly, Neil. *I'm* your friend. If only to hack you off so that you
can't write 'I don't have any friends' any more.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 11:33:00 -0800
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Strictly OT, but Nuking Japan was RE: many, many people
Message-ID: <3884BFEB.ECDECF15@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Alison Page wrote:
> Which makes one think - why is this clearly spurious information being made
> 'available' all of a sudden? What is the origin of this story? Was it being
> put about at the time (in 1945) to justify the bombing?
Well, I do apologize for bringing it up, then, having forgotten
the title and author. I'd dig it out but I do know I've thrown
out the catalog (which I will say leans more to the left than
the right.) What little I do remember is that the declassified
documents mentioned were supposedly captured Japanese
communiques, and that the author was praised in the article
for his scholarly work on this and previous books.
Back on topic, a bit. How much room might there have been
between liberal and conservative media in the Federation?
Do you suppose they practiced even the appearance of free
speech, allowing, say, criticism of some minor official or
unimportant policy as a matter of misdirection from things
they didn't want the public speculating or agitating about?
Or did everything have to be 100% supportive of official
Federation policy? Or--perhaps they left some leeway in
order to identify potential troublemakers, that's my guess.
Mistral
--
"Who do you serve? And who do you trust?"
--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 20:12:07 +0000
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <oXcJ+HAXkMh4EwU9@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <20000117.171738.8750.1.Rilliara@juno.com>, Ellynne G.
<rilliara@juno.com> writes
>
>On Mon, 17 Jan 2000 23:27:41 +0000 Julia Jones
><julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>Prozac.
>>
>>That stuff they feed hyperactive children, definition of "hyperactive"
>>in some cases including "brighter than the teacher". (Yes, I know it
>>can
>>be very helpful in genuine cases of hyperactivity.)
the things you spot *after* posting...
There should be an "or" at the start of the second paragraph. The
perils of not fully trained voice recognition software. Susan Beth,
take note.
what I was referring to with Prozac was the alleged suggestion by some
American therapists that everyone should be put on Prozac, since
everyone has a right to be happy.
You are happy, aren't you, friend Citizen? After all, The Computer is
your friend...
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 20:14:16 +0000 (GMT)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0118201416-063Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
On Tue 18 Jan, Una McCormack wrote:
> Neil wrote:
>
> > That might be difficult - I don't have any friends.
>
> Don't be silly, Neil. *I'm* your friend. If only to hack you off so that you
> can't write 'I don't have any friends' any more.
Hey, unfair, you beat me to it!
Neil <grin>, I *love* you.
Judith
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight )
Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 20:38:55 -0000
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: "Lysator List" <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Many many people...
Message-ID: <106801bf61f4$104e88c0$0d01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Judith wrote:
> On Tue 18 Jan, Una McCormack wrote:
> > Neil wrote:
> >
> > > That might be difficult - I don't have any friends.
> >
> > Don't be silly, Neil. *I'm* your friend. If only to hack you off so that
you
> > can't write 'I don't have any friends' any more.
>
> Hey, unfair, you beat me to it!
>
> Neil <grin>, I *love* you.
Fight you for him.
Una
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V00 Issue #16
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